Primary School Matters

[JoJo]

Two pieces of advice from the learned p45ers if you will:

[1] Which School?
There's 3 primary schools in the parish in which we live.
One has 740 pupils, one has 91 pupils and one is a Gaelscoil
They're all mixed and all approximately equidistant from the house.
I haven't applied for a place for the SPO in any yet for September 2009/2010 (See question 2 below), but assuming I can get a place.. to which one should I send her?

The small school only has 4 teachers and doubles up on classes.. so junior and senior infants share a classroom and teacher, 1st and 2nd class share.. and so on. They only take in 10 students a year, so the class size is pretty small, even though it is shared. In addition to the 4 teachers, they have 1.5 permanent resource teachers (or whatever those teachers are who give extra help to kids that need it) on staff.

I haven't been to see the big school yet, but it would have 1 teacher per class and probably have 5 classes of junior infants etc. It probably has good facilities and grants/budgets because of the number of students. It probably also has resource teachers on tap.

The Gaelscoil is a gaelscoil.

I like the idea of the small place. Would the bigger school be better though? Woud the gaelscoil be better again?


[2] What age to send the SPO to school?
She will be 4 in May 2009. The small school and the gaelscoil only take children who are 4 in March 2009, so she would have to wait until September 2010 to go to school, when she would be 5. I am not 100% sure about the big school, but I think they would take her in 2009 at 4 years of age.
So.. do I send her to school at 4 or 5?

All advice welcome !
(JoJo - parenting by internet since 2005 :toothy: )

[Eeeek]

4. Big school all the way.

[Pógxsmuhowney Pohl]

You are not going to call her Small Pink One in front of her classmates--right?

poor kid

[JoJo]

4. Big school all the way.

Why do you think so?

[JoJo]

Hmm.. just found out that the big school won't take her until 5 either.
That's mad Ted.
Her birthday is in May.. and the cut-off for the schools accepting pupils in the September is March/April. Another 2 years of Montessori to go?

[Eeeek]

Why do you think so?
Because the kids from very small primary schools always, always, always have a more difficult time adjusting the high school. The sheer size, amount of teachers, amount of kids, etc is just too much for them.

[Griffin]

5 is the better age to start as she'd seem too young otherwise at the other end, G will also be 5 starting (by about five days).

The gaelscoil (as much as I hate Irish) would probably be the better option as the numbers would be low without shared classes although the big school will have far more social interaction

[Sleepy the Dwarf]

Because the kids from very small primary schools always, always, always have a more difficult time adjusting the high school. The sheer size, amount of teachers, amount of kids, etc is just too much for them.

Speaking as someone that went to a school similar to JoJo describes, I had no difficulty adjusting to a large second level school.

To answer your question JoJo, I'd avoid the small school that doubles up on classes. We often went days without being taught anything, as the class we shared a room and teacher with were particularly ... erm... challenged, and found certain concepts hard to grasp. Our "timetables" were purely fictional, and we only ever had one PE class (that I can remember). I'd lean towards the gaelscoil myself, tbh. They have a good reputation.

[doyler]

wait till she is 5.

and send her to the small (91 pupil) school.

in that school EVERY teacher will know her, will know her name, will know her family, will know YOU! and she will know everybody, in 3rd class she will know, and play with, 1st class pupils as well as 5th class pupils,

what chance that in a 700+ pupil school?

[scruff monkey]

in that school EVERY teacher will know her, will know her name, will know her family

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/CLASS/130-126~Big-Brother-is-Watching-You-Posters.jpg

[Pete]

in that school EVERY teacher will know her, will know her name, will know her family, will know YOU! and she will know everybody, in 3rd class she will know, and play with, 1st class pupils as well as 5th class pupils,
So she will know everybody, but what will she know? I personally think that the bigger school would be better for the simple fact that the classes aren't double up. These are very important development years and do you really want what sleepy described?

[Rob]

The Gaelscoil all the way, teachers are paid more and are bound to be that bit more enthusiastic

[Mugsey]

just because you are paid mroe doesn't mean you are gonna be more entuastic take most of the civil service managers for instance


The Gaelscoil all the way, teachers are paid more and are bound to be that bit more enthusiastic

[SlapHead]

just because you are paid mroe doesn't mean you are gonna be more entuastic take most of the civil service managers for instance
It doesn't seem to apply to English teachers anyway.

[Burger Rare]

I went to a school like the small one you describe - 120 pupils, 4-5 teachers depending on how many students in a given year, and I don't think it did me any harm. I kept my head down for a while when I went to secondary (700 pupils) but I think that was more me than because I came from a small school. I still tend to keep the head down and observe for a while when in a new place.

I think you'd really have to go and interview the head teacher and the infants teacher(s) in both of the schools (assuming you've ruled out the Gaelscoil based on what you've said above), and get a feel for the place and make your decision based on that.

[AngelOfDeath]

Big school, completely.

I would rather be skinned than willingly send a child to an Irish school-- I have college-age friends who still have to translate basic math into fucking Irish to be able to manage it; it's time wasting nonsense.

I went to a small, doubled-up school myself, and your child will invariably encounter one of three problems. If she's clever, she'll find herself abandoning her own work to attend to the more interesting work she's seeing across the classroom and will miss out on valuable, if monumentally boring, bits of her own work that will come back to haunt her later. If she's average, she'll be ignored. If she's a below average, she'll be worse than ignored, she'll be left potter around at her own speed because there are kids in the class at a lower level so it's not a big issue for her to be doing less advanced work than her same-age class mates.

Again: big school, no question.

[JoJo]

The results so far. Plenty of differing opinions. I still don't know which to go for, although on paper (well, screen) the small school is trailing behind the other two. Which is a shame, as I really liked the feel of the place.

Small school
Pro - Everyone knows you. Less intimidating for child. Small class size.
Con - Shared teachers

Gaelscoil
Pro - Small class size. Teachers likely to be into it. Should make Irish easy for Leaving Cert.
Con - Have to translate maths into Irish for ever after? Might have to speak Irish at home?

Big School
Pro - Probably has good facilities. Easier to adjust to secondary school.
Con - Huge student population.

[asdasd]

Con - Have to translate maths into Irish for ever after? Might have to speak Irish at home?

yeah, i wouldnt worry about these issues. Maths is basically it's own language and no-one loses the ability to speak english at a gaelscoil.

[Bandraoi]

I wouldn't worry about the speaking Irish at home or whatever with a Gaelscoil. It doesn't come up.

I think the advantage they offer is that parents usually actively choose them. What you end up with is a self selected group of parents who value education and a group of children who come from houses where education is valued.

[Pógxsmuhowney Pohl]

If your kid is outgoing, sporty and active go for the big school; quiet and sensitive, go for the small school.
One of my kids (Boy) graduated from smalll Montessori school to a big Catholic High School and had a huge problem adjusting to the later years. The other (girl) had problems with the big city schools and ended up being homeschooled. She is now graduating to a small Montessori High School. If I had a chance to do it over I would reverse both situations.

[Rob]

I have college-age friends who still have to translate basic math into fucking Irish to be able to manage it; it's time wasting nonsense.
Bullshit, a large proportion of my job is math; basic and otherwise and I've never had to "translate" it.

[harveythewonderhorse]

was educated through Irish, shock horror, we were given terms in boths languages..that is the usual in most Gaelscoileanna,wait till she is 5, what's the rush? I went to school at 3.5 (they wanted the numbers ) and I was terribly young doing the leaving and going into college.2 classes in one room can actually be an asset, younger children can work with the older ones and be grouped more on ability than on age,benefits both weaker and more academic children. I'd avoid the big school, to be honest, it would be very intimidating on a 4/5 yr old..

[Pógxsmuhowney Pohl]

I had Flann O'Riain as my third class teacher ( Of Daithí Lacha fame)
There was not a single word of Bearla allowed in his class. He even taught English in Irish.
If his 2 year old son could speak Gaeilge fluently then there was no excuse for a bunch of phlaicas like us not to..Aililiú!! arsa puisín!

[stretchneil]

Gaelscoil. The 5 years I spent going to one provided me with a much better education than the remaining 8 years of schooling in larger English-speaking schools.

[harveythewonderhorse]

best advice, make appt to meet all three principals, you'll get a good idea of what the school is like by meeting them

[Pógxsmuhowney Pohl]

Pick the one with the biggest breasts

[Pógxsmuhowney Pohl]

Pick the school with the rich kids; that's usually the best.

[able locks]

curly locks is starting in a small school in sept. - we're moving a rural area so it's the parish school. One of the main reasons we're moving is so she'll go to a smaller school rather than a larger school - 19 kids in junior infants versus 100.

Go back to your comment

I really liked the feel of the place.

re-visit the schools, try and talk to parents of kids in those schools and then make a decision on it.

(and there's nothing to stop you booking your kids into all 3 and making your final decision closer to the time)

[Lanod]

The Gaelscoil all the way, teachers are paid more and are bound to be that bit more enthusiastic

Gaelscoils tend to get better teachers as they require that little bit of extra effort (i.e. the ability to teach through Irish). Also, from a purely selfish point of view, gaelscoils tend to get less of the kids (immigrants and special needs) who will need more attention and thus mean that your child gets more attention. If anyone finds that offensive they can suck my virtual balls.

[ArseBurger]

Send them to private boarding school. They'll get a better education and be off your hands until they're 17.

[Bandraoi]

Send them to private boarding school. They'll get a better education and be off your hands until they're 17.
Not to mention a child abuse claim with a settlement that'll set them up for life.