the office of Pres.

[damnnamething2001]

In the CNN debate by the Democratic candidates the other night…Larry King asked if they would be in favor of a constitutional amendment allowing naturalized citizens to run for president. Under the constitution, only natural born citizens can seek that office. Foreign born individuals who become US citizens can serve in the House (7 years a citizen I believe) and the Senate (10 years a citizen).
This raises the question of whether the Republicans will push for such an amendment to allow Arnold to run eventually, thus capitalizing on his “box office” appeal. This is nothing new for Republicans. They suggested the same thing when Nixon was president, thinking in terms of Henry Kissinger to run for office. (now that’s scary)
They also were toying with trying to cancel the amendment limiting a president to two terms in office. They were quite heady with Nixon’s landslide victory and had visions of giving him a third and perhaps fourth term. (God help us) Interestingly, it was the Republicans who proposed and pushed the amendment limiting terms. They saw FDR elected to four consecutive terms and feared they would never see the Whitehouse again.

Anyway…interested in seeing some debate on whether you think the office should remain limited to natural born citizens.

[magicbastarder]

was there any consensus on the debate on those points?

[magicbastarder]

just wondering what the arguments were pro and anti, it's not something i've really ever given any thought to, so i don't have an opinion.

[damnnamething2001]

actually, Kerry and Edwards said they never really thought about it and didn't give an answer. Understandable since it might offend some foreign born citizens if they said no. But, in reality, every foreign born citizen has the opportunity to see their American born children have that opportuinty. It is a touchy issue. The framers of the constitution had a good reason. They didn't want someone with perhaps more loyalty to another nation, or perhaps divided loyalties, sitting in that office. Especially since power over the armed forces is vested in that position. I thnk that concern still resonates today.

[magicbastarder]

since i'm slightly dubious about giving ex-pats the vote, i think i have no problem with denying naturalised citizens the presidency.

are people who have a passport since birth (e.g. people whose parentage entitles them to a passport), but who were born and reared in a foreign country, treated any differently by voting laws, from people who were born and reared in a country?

[damnnamething2001]

If you are born of American parents..no matter where, you are considered a natural born American and have all the same rights and priviledges. . You also have dual citizenship. interesting situation. lol Happens a lot with military people.

[colinsky]

I'm in favour of removing all national borders and making us all citizens of the world. So, fine with me.

[K]

the US doesn't recognize dual citizenships.

[damnnamething2001]

Originally posted by K
the US doesn't recognize dual citizenships.

EHHHHHHHHH Wrong. They do indeed. When I moved to Canada in 79 I would have had to give up my American citizenship if I took out Canadian. That law changed years ago, and now I can have both. Also, my kids, being born in Canada, are Canadian but were automatically also American until they were 18, then they would have to apply for dual. Before the age of 18 all I had to do was file the forms related to a foreign birth to an American citizen. Plus, their mother isn;t American and that doesn't matter a fig. The times have changed.

Plus...a number of American citizens who were unable to make the American Olympic teasm in their chosen sport...but whose parents were of..say...Italian heritage...were allowed by italy to take out Italian citizenship and go to the Olympics for them. All of that and they retained their American citizenship.

[damnnamething2001]

for your interest. from this web site http://www.richw.org/dualcit/#Overview

For example, my son has been a dual citizen of both the US and Canada from the day he was born. He is a citizen of the US (via ius sanguinis), because his parents are both US citizens who fulfilled the US's legal requirement of residency in the US prior to his birth. And he is also a citizen of Canada (via ius soli), because he was born in Canada and neither my wife nor myself were in Canada as foreign diplomats.

I, too, am a dual citizen of both the US and Canada -- a citizen of the US because I was born in the US, and a citizen of Canada because I went through the Canadian naturalization process.

Countries usually frame their citizenship laws with little or no regard for the citizenship laws of other countries. In my son's case, for instance, the US does not care that Canada thinks he is a Canadian citizen, and Canada does not care that the US thinks he is a US citizen. Sometimes a country may seek to restrict dual citizenship by requiring one of its citizens born with some other citizenship to renounce (give up) the other citizenship upon reaching adulthood. Newly naturalized citizens may similarly be required to renounce their previous citizenship(s); the US has such a requirement, for example, but Canada does not. In some cases, a country will automatically revoke the citizenship of one of its citizens who acquires another country's citizenship by naturalization, even if no explicit renunciation was involved.


alos....

DUAL NATIONALITY
Dual nationality can occur as the result of a variety of circumstances. The automatic acquisition or retention of a foreign nationality, acquired, for example, by birth in a foreign country or through an alien parent, does not affect U.S. citizenship. It is prudent, however, to check with authorities of the other country to see if dual nationality is permissible under local law. Dual nationality can also occur when a person is naturalized in a foreign state without intending to relinquish U.S. nationality and is thereafter found not to have lost U.S. citizenship the individual consequently may possess dual nationality. While recognizing the existence of dual nationality and permitting Americans to have other nationalities, the U.S. Government does not endorse dual nationality as a matter of policy because of the problems which it may cause. Claims of other countries upon dual-national U.S. citizens often place them in situations where their obligation to one country are in conflict with the laws of the other. In addition, their dual nationality may hamper efforts to provide U.S. diplomatic and consular protection to them when they are abroad.

[Damo]

I think if they do pass an amendment allowing foreign born citizens run it should carry a proviso that actors are ineligible.

[K]

"Countries usually frame their citizenship laws with little or no regard for the citizenship laws of other countries. In my son's case, for instance, the US does not care that Canada thinks he is a Canadian citizen, and Canada does not care that the US thinks he is a US citizen."

This is what I was talking about when I said the US doesn't recognize dual citizenships.